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Instant Graemlins. Bush removes bill making wicca a religion I think UBBFriend: Email this page to someone! Topic: George W. To all my brothers an sisters of the old religion join in my outrage I have just finished reading an article saying that president Bush is now trying to remove the bill saying that Wiccan is an actual religion.

He says he can't see letting troops build bon fires an dance around with athames George bush eating kitten celebrate thier holidays. This is rediculous we have prosecuted an condemed for George bush eating kitten of years an when we finally make alittle head way the goverment wants to stomp us back into the ground all over agian. Was it not bad enough that for hundreds of years we were drowned, burned, crusified, beheaded, and tortured because we didn't believe in the same thing as everyone else.

So I am posting this to ask that every pagan, wiccan, or occult believer that shares my outrage please repost this an lets see if we can make some kind of difference. Please add your name below if you agree. I've googled albeit quickly and didn't really come up with anything - other than George W. I also looked on the main site anywhere I thought was relevant but didn't see it there either.

Second, I was under the impression it is already recognized as a "religion", at least as far as protection under First Amendment rights cite. The bulletin sounds like a teenager wanting to have a cause much as I was when I was young and wanted something other than Christianity to turn to. George bush eating kitten definently George bush eating kitten possibility I think that's what I George bush eating kitten from it.

I now see that it says "trying to remove the bill. Is there even one such bill declaring Wicca a religion in existance? I was under the impression from the religioustolerance. ETA: blackroses, made my edit while you were making yours. Hope mine clarified, I was a bit confused, your clarification is what I realized afterwards. Surely not with such an eloquent writing style Pondicherry Pi Deck the Malls. Isn't there some to-do about that right now? I was thinking the same thing. There's a thread on it somewhere around here, but all I could find at the present is this article Snopes posted.

It's pretty informative about Wiccans trying to be accepted in America, but doesn't say anything about GWB. George bush eating kitten can't believe everything is your fault unless you also believe you're all powerful.

I used to think that was kind of cute and immature. Now -- well, I feel a little less secure in mine as well. But no, Bush can't make Wicca "not a religion" any more than he could declare a state religion. Legally a president or anyone else in govt has no say in what is a religion or is not, except in cases where the courts are deciding if some group is an actual religion and not just something set up to skirt the laws, such as "churches" a few years or even weeks old claiming drugs are part of their religion.

There are several dozen peyote users from the Native American Church in prison in Oregon and other states. At the same time, rather bizarrely, the courts have ruled whites can use peyote if they're part of a "church" set up by James "Flaming Eagle," Mooney, a white imitator falsely claiming to be Native and denounced by the NAC for commercial sales of peyote, a big taboo for the NAC. The courts and state govts also routinely bar Santeria believers from sacrificing animals.

The federal govt barred Native religions for centuries, actually had state George bush eating kitten Christian denominations for each reservation. Native religions have never been George bush eating kitten by the 1st Amendment and only got statutory protection in Ironically the only place where Natives could always be certain their beliefs were protected was in the US military, within limits.

Native religious prohibitions against haircuts were not George bush eating kitten, except among the Indian Scouts. Peyote use by Natives in the military is legal, but you can't use it if you'll be on duty the next day. That restricts it to Friday or Saturday nights, when traditionally it's usually done on Sundays since NAC members think of themselves as good Christians.

Like others, I wonder if the original complaint is related to the military. Carrying blades is banned on bases, and they'd probably need special exceptions for their athames. Same for bonfires. And the recent stories about evangelicals persecuting non-evangelicals at the Air Force Academy might be related to this.

What a coincidence, it's ours too! They must be the same god. Join us! Blah blah I'm good for nothing - will you love me just the same? Greetings from the dark side I treat Wicca with much respect, but you're wrong here. Wicca isn't all that old, as far as religions go. There have been nature religions and religions that one could consider "Pagan" far before Christianity, yes.

Wicca was not one of them, however. Wiki Article No real proof either way in that George bush eating kitten, but the belief that it didn't really start until the 's seems to be more George bush eating kitten based on the information I have learned through other sources throughout the years. This seems a bit snarky if it's directed at those of us within the thread trying to educate ourselves through discussion.

If George bush eating kitten directed at the quote, George bush eating kitten, it makes more sense. But considering your first sentence, if it is snark it's probably a bit misplaced. No offense. I was under the assumption that Wicca dated back to the other Pagan traditions.

As for the other comment, Midgard, I intended no snark. I simply meant that there are people out there who obviously know more than I do about the subject, and they would do a better job than I would of defending the position.

Unfortunately, in this case, it led to me speaking poorly. But again you mentioned the small children, and they are an acceptable scapegoat in this case. And they're still in jail because the Supreme Court already ruled that, since such laws were not passed with the intent of restricting religion, but rather with a reasonable aim to banning hallucinogenic drugs and such, that they did not violate the 1st amendment. Affecting the practice of their religions was merely a collateral consequence that was, ostensibly, unintended.

Same as above. If a city passes a law outlawing the slaughtering of animals outside of permitted slaughter houses within its limits for the purposes of sanitation and it also happens to mean some guy can't sacrifice a goat anymore, then too bad. The aim was reasonable and the law not passed with the intent of stifling religious practices. Ok, the entire Indian Scout thing seems Saxi xxi hindi actrs bit dated.

I can see it now. We're alongside a 20, ton oiler taking on fuel going 13 knots and only ft apart. The conning officer notices that the distance is closing and orders a course to open, but the helmsman is too busy trippin' and communing with his ancestors to notice and George bush eating kitten ships collide.

Damn, the military sure is evil, not letting people hallucinate on duty or, better yet, just grant them the day off any time they choose to go on a spiritual journey of self discovery using hallucinogenic drugs as a facilitator. Honestly, I'm surprised the military would allow it at all, even on non-duty days. I don't know about you, but not permitting personnel to walk around with personal weapons when they could find themselves in a drunken bar George bush eating kitten or better yet tripped out on a hallucinogenic drug seems pretty reasonable to me.

Contrary to what some may think, people in the military don't just walk around and go to the grocery store and take a crap with weapons when they're not in a combat zone. As for the bonfires Oh, that's a good one "Sir, we've got a problem, there are snipers in the buildings down the street, but it's the solstice and Pvt.

Timmy is Wicca, so he says we've gotta let him build a fire and dance around it. Which courts and when? I find it hard to believe that the courts explicitly offered protection to this guy and this guy alone while still making it illegal for Native Americans to use it. So, in other words, Native religions have NOT never been protected. They are now. I'll have to go with the "ranting teen with a persecution-complex and poor understanding of current events regarding the grave marker issue" theory myself.

And, hypocritically claim simultaneously that if smaller faiths get their practices banned, well George bush eating kitten sure deserved it, those damned freaks! I grant you the 1st Amendment was a good idea, but your naive faith in it is not generally shared by many minority faiths. Word choice intentional, since your faith in it seems to border on religiosity. If we want to continue our traditions, we look to those traditions and not to outside protection since several hundred years of experience has shown us it can't be relied on.

All anyone has George bush eating kitten do is go look up the literally hundreds of cases where the BIA or reservation superintendants issued regulations specifically prohibiting "savage dances," "ceremonies that promote unhealthy generosity," etc. Or read about the imprisonment or witholding of food for entire families George bush eating kitten on rumors not proof that a single member might have taken part in said dances or ceremonies which, far from being dangerous, their main sin was simply not to be Christian in origin.

Or, if you don't want to dig through BIA memos, just read about Wounded Knee, or even the thousands of Muslim George bush eating kitten summarily deported after If I George bush eating kitten a judge who outlawed circumcision on cruelty grounds, my intent would obviously include not caring about how it barred a specifically religious George bush eating kitten. My paternalistic attitude would be that George bush eating kitten personally knew better than thousands of years of Jewish tradition.

And your assumption that no one ever passes laws in response to public outcry over religious practices most of the public doesn't understand is very naive. NAC members don't take peyote to get high and have a wild time anymore than congregation George bush eating kitten get wasted on the sacramental wine. It's a solemn ceremony lasting hours, with prayer and singing and meditation.

And Santeros' practices are generally more sanitary than anything Swift or Oscar Mayer do in their factories.

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